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 No.16420 [View All]

Worst thread on EC.

Previous >>12299
262 posts and 61 image replies omitted. Click reply to view.

 No.17952

>>>A
> [group B] is bad
> [group A] good
>>>C
> what about [group C] (and [group D])?
> also, you stupid.
>>>A
> C(and D) = B
> also: no, you
how about [topic] instead?

The only time ever a [topic] currently gets mentioned is for whataboutism or moving the goal post.

 No.17953 KONTRA

mechanicalmind.jpg (86.27 KB, 600x400)

>>17952
I favor arguments instead of groups :^)

 No.17960

>>17951
For thirty years, very little has been published about your sect. A few sentences by the bpb here and there, a dissertation that was very likely written by a sect member, little else.

What they generally had to say boils down to a 'a bunch of fart-sniffers in love with irony and long sentences, who try to lecture everyone, but have been grumpy for five decades, because no one wants to listen'.

I read 2 Gegenstandpunkt-issues in 2005 and 2006. That was a mistake, it would have been enough to read 1. From this experience, I wholeheartedly agree with the general assessment.

By the way, how much of your monthly income do you donate to the gurus? Is MG cheaper than Jehovah's witnesses?

>You can

I can, but I and everyone else would lack any incentive to do so. When that realization hits the marxists, we get war-communism, de-kulalization, cleansings, a great leap forward, the cultural revolution...

> simply

Simply is a weasel-word. Whenever someone uses it, I translate it to
> I am ignoring problems, likely willfully, possibly in an effort to shift blame.

> produce use value,

Goods and services are produced, use value is not derived at the point of production, but at the point of use.

> why go the route of accumulating money

The function of money is a) medium of barter b) storage of value

> as the first goal

Accumulating money is not a goal at all. The opposite is true: Dead capital must be avoided whenever possible.

Assuming (tall assumption) goods and services are produced, how are they allocated, so deriving use-value would even be possible? Allocation by request trivially devolves into FCFS, so there will be scalping and barter in kind (capitalist black market profiteering! Guess we need stalinism to prevent that!) or planned allocation (history showed us the efficiencies unlocked by planned economies.)

Of course, a Marxist will argue that all goods will be produced in such quantities that there will never be any shortages. No, wrong, barely anything would be produced (no incentive), what would be produced would be of questionable quality, it would be hoarded and misused, i. e. feeding bread rolls to pigs. The misuse would happen even in the absence of shortages and, in itself, cause shortages, because no disincentive in the form of costs would exist to prevent the use of high-value goods where low-value goods would suffice.

> You want

I also eat small children, fried. Muslims and Africans in Germany are not a law of nature. They are brought here by government intervention. The immigration of guest workers was a government program, asylum is a government program. The status quo is a strong state in action.

The government intervention of flying an immigrant back to his country of origin is obviously smaller (thousands of euro) than having an immigrant on welfare for 60 years, paying for his health care, and his jail time, etc. We are talking low five-figures vs. hundreds of thousands, possibly millions. The second intervention (deportation) would be completely unnecessary without the first intervention (attracting immigrants as a government policy.)

Without the government intervening, parts of Germany might even be freed from Muslims and Africans by spontaneous citizen action, without any need for government intervention.

> The MG

The MG is anti-government. In the view of the MG, proletarians (those dense idiots) 'need' (like a fish needs a bicycle) the academicians of the MG to lecture them in Marxist theory. So who aims to be in ideological control of the workers, and thus, the worker's government?

Abstaining from stating your implied intentions or even denying them does not make those intentions nil.

 No.17964 KONTRA

>>17960
> very little has been published

ok, and?

>how much of your monthly income do you donate to the gurus?


None, I also don't think they are sympathetic people.

>lack any incentive


people don't want to produce and have useful things? Having useful things is not an incentive?

>Goods and services are produced, use value is not derived at the point of production, but at the point of use


Goods and services are produced when they are considered useful. You don't invest a million bucks just to produce a thing nobody will use. Well, I'm sure it occasionally happens.

>The function of money is a) medium of barter b) storage of value


Yeah. So?

>Accumulating money is not a goal at all. The opposite is true: Dead capital must be avoided whenever possible.


Exactly, dead capital must be avoided, simple storage is not helpful (Schatzbildung). You have money and use it as capital that leverages more money that then again takes the form of capital and so on. In that sense, dead capital is a sin indeed. But the goal is to make more capital that has the form of money. Thus, it is about accumulating money. No business produces anything useful if in the end invested money has not multiplied, it is G-W-G'.

>Allocation


Why are request and planning necessarily opposites?

>feeding bread rolls to pigs.


I'm pretty sure bread rolls are fed to pigs or other animals. Or what happens with all the leftover bread rolls that pile up at the end of each day in Germany?

>Marxist will argue that all goods will be produced in such quantities that there will never be any shortages


Well, German supermarkets and other places where you can buy useful things are fully stacked. So technically producing a lot of things in abundance for people is not the problem. But instead of abundance, we have to make things artificially scarce and eventually just throw away things in abundance because they did not sell. Good resource management should be awarded.

What you say here is that people are stupid monkeys that will be wasteful and self-destructive if not controlled by a violent power. Especially people who work for a wage like many craftspeople or factory workers, engineers and HR people need to be enforced by law a restricted access. How? by using money as medium for access to useful things.
So you think that since humans are stupid monkeys, they need a political cadre of more clever monkeys who know how to control allocation in the best way and make decisions for these stupid monkeys both capitalists and their workers and regulate how things are produced. That these political cadres favor workers getting less out of their labor than the people that bought their labor force is no problem for you. Stupid worker monkeys need to understand that is the most beneficial arrangement for them.

>immigration issue


I don't know why you use so many words to just say that "yes, I want a strong state in these concerns and I want a weak state in other concerns." You move within the confines that have been brought up as the confines of critique within the democratic state elsewhere.

 No.17965 KONTRA

>The MG is anti-government. In the view of the MG, proletarians (those dense idiots) 'need' (like a fish needs a bicycle) the academicians of the MG to lecture them in Marxist theory. So who aims to be in ideological control of the workers, and thus, the worker's government?

Maybe you should read more than the Wikipedia:

>The MG is anti-government


Yes. And while I don't know the whole body of work I would carefully add that the state and especially the democratic state are understood as an institution that has to go.

>MG, proletarians (those dense idiots) 'need' (like a fish needs a bicycle) the academicians of the MG to lecture them in Marxist theory


This is incorrect and you can read the Arbeitskonferenzpapier. Science and production, academy and production are separated (in capitalism). Hence the mediational demand. And of course, the MG says that they have good arguments to explain how capitalism works and what consequences it has for different people. If you think these arguments are wrong then so be it. You either dicuss arguments and they make sense for you or they don't there is not more you can do in this mediational role.

>Wer als kommunistischer Intellektueller, und das heißt immer, mit dem Wissen über den Kapitalismus ausgestattet, die Vermittlung seiner Einsichten an das Proletariat vollziehen will, ist nicht herablassender „Pädagoge", er zieht nur die Konsequenzen aus seinen Einsichten. Daß dies kein Gängeln des Proletariats bedeutet, geht daraus hervor, daß die Arbeiter in solchem Versuch als Subjekte unterstellt sind, die der Einsicht in ihre objektive Lage — und das nennt Engels „Klassenbewußtsein" — fähig sind, und daß sie es sind, die sich Wissen aneignen (2).


>Die Vermittlungstätigkeit hat so an der tagtäglichen Praxis des Proletariats anzusetzen. Was es aus den Inhalten der Agitation erfährt, ist das Wissen über seine Stellung im Kapitalismus. Ihm wird seine eigene Bestimmung wissenschaftlich erklärt.


So in essence somebody tries to explain the economic and social happenings with arguments. As a worker, you can listen to these arguments and try to understand them and come up with your conclusions or you don't. Whether the workers agree with the arguments or not says nothing about the validity of these arguments - the workers don't have a scientific insight into their position just by being workers. Just like a human has no scientific insight into the universe just by being a human. It is a question of reasoning. That is the "scientific" base of the MG, I would say at this point in time.

 No.17968 KONTRA

>>17964
>Goods and services are produced when they are considered useful. You don't invest a million bucks just to produce a thing nobody will use. Well, I'm sure it occasionally happens.
It never happens, the products still hold value, as enough labor mana was invested into them.
I think it's same kind of survivorship bias that led David Ricardo to formulate that value comes from labor. Of course, the ongoing transformation of the economical landscape from one of primary commodities into a volatile global market driven by overproduction of merchandise complicates this theory. So as not to clash with religious canon, obfuscations and semantic games were played for centuries by the brightest minds of academia - including the MG.
As committed revolutionaries to the cause of social equality and elevation of the human condition, we must climb out of this morass of tl;dr critique circlejerking and behead in public square these clerics of socialism who have done nothing but perpetuate capitalism through their poisoning of the well of possible alternatives with pseudoscientific swill.
It is only when the last MG member is beheaded that the masses can begin to formulate their thoughts in a revolutionary direction, they'll be able to reclaim the word communism from those positivist freaks. Let go of the LTV and you will find a new world of routes to a better tomorrow. For more information, pre-order Die Handy Und Das Geist at your local library.

 No.17969 KONTRA

>>17968
I think it was zeitgeist before. Doesn't matter, titles shouldn't be static. Ghost Phone.

 No.17970 KONTRA

>>17968
>that the masses can begin to formulate their thoughts in a revolutionary direction

Which state agent will they vote for?

 No.17971 KONTRA

>>17970
The present state will witness an lessening of its own autonomy as an actor. The power associated with the state will be redirected to direct democracy initiatives. This happens alongside a reorganization of the present capitalist economic model into the Ernestian model.

 No.17972 KONTRA

>>17971
And this gem will play in the background
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n4RjJKxsamQ

 No.17978

Westerners, do you visit pride parade?

https://twitter.com/sav_says_/status/1807556485754569051
https://twitter.com/sav_says_/status/1807580371909009629
https://twitter.com/sav_says_/status/1807513099714388039
https://twitter.com/sav_says_/status/1807220308262162792
Probably there should be two separate celebrations on different days. One about tolerance to minorities and acceptance of different people. And another one about exposing yourself sexually and letting the steam off. Modern 18+ analog of Bacchanalia.
Otherwise the message gets distorted: "We piss on each other and we stand with Palestine!"

 No.17979 KONTRA

>>17978
Pride has gone woke.

 No.17980 KONTRA

>>17979
Yes, thought about the same cartoon after writing the post :D

 No.17981

>>17978
It's an odd society we live in. Evidently people just want to go outside and jizz on each other, but it must be wrapped in the mantles of activism so it isn't a social faux pas. I like the concept of separating them, no politics during bacchanalia - thanks.

 No.17982

>>17978
I never visited a pride parade. The only semblance of western demonstrative activism I displayed was during the climate strike in 2018. I keep a fond memory of the event, we were mostly youngsters and retirees, the ambiance was joyful.
I was in hs and it meant we’d got a free afternoon

 No.17983

1716627746048302.jpg (3.23 MB, 3084x3195)

Boy I sure love getting used by virtue-signaling soulless companies for publicity and how they always care about me, even when I am not buying their stuff or outside of pride month!
I also love being reduced to my sexuality because I don't have any actual character to speak of!
And I certainly love other people speaking for me!

 No.17984

>>17983
Relax, fruitcake. It's just a rainbow corporate logo.

 No.17985 KONTRA

>>17982
The only protest/democratic public event I remember going to was in HS as well: the Education Strike in 2009 or so. Free day as well for me.
Through all those years I already have been an MGler who knew a protest is a powerless action, and I was depressive enough to convince myself that self-empowerment, the feel-good of protesting, is a delusion.

If people want to celebrate themselves and their sexuality and their culture that's fine. I guess public sexual acts at such an event are not the best idea. It's a bit tricky since I like public sex myself and you never know who might "catch" you when you are doing it, depending on where you do it etc. But a parade seems not a good choice to do it and force it on a lot of people, especially when we are speaking about practices that go beyond mere penetration.

 No.17987

>>17856
was a bit disappointed

Some fun moments, but in general as expected, but with even less substance. They don't even say "reforms", it's that bad.

One fun moment was when they switched roles, and Trump suddenly defended America as doing great and Biden tried to talk it down. Later they did the opposite (and the roles were as you would expect: incumbent defending the state of the nation, challenger shittalking it)

but "the end is nigh" came from both, very nice touch

 No.18084

Untitled.jpeg (176.83 KB, 894x894)


 No.18085

>>18084
Without context I have a hard time assessing what this picture is trying to convey.

 No.18086

>>18085
Conservatives lost the elections, Labour party won. End of Good Ol' England, occupation by Euroreich.
https://apnews.com/live/uk-election-results-updates

 No.18088

>>18086
>Conservatives lost the elections
Huh? I thought all of Europe was undergoing a strong righ-shift?

 No.18089

>>18088
The Tories ruled Britain for over a decade. In that period they failed to deliver on any of their conservative promises and burned through their more competent and experienced cadres in that period to the point where you had people like Truss and Sunak at the helm. So a lot of their voters simply just told them to fuck off.

The moderates went over to Labour after it washed its hands of Corbyn's brand of socialism (Though Corbyn himself got a seat as an independent, with nearly 50% of the vote in his constituency). Starmer's as grey a grey suit as it gets. I was semi-following the whole thing but I couldn't tell you a single thing about the man besides the fact that he at one point edited a Trot journal at university (perfectly normal for British politicians actually.) or any of his policies besides "We will protect the NHS" ("What from?" probably forces from the Moon.)

The right-wing voters who want the foreigners gone and would do Brexit all over again went over to Reform UK, which is essentially UKIP's descendant.
Reform was initially polling below the Tories but slowly caught up to them, outpolling them in some cases. Mostly due to Farage rejoining the party and spearheading the campaign.

The catastrophic loss of the Tories can mainly be attributed to Reform UK getting really strong (not reflected in the seats) and "splitting" the right vote against a relatively united Left-camp. (Then again, the fun begins once you're in government so we will see how Labour fares now that they have to actually deliver on running the country.)

 No.18091

>>18089
It's simpler than that. Labours are Gryffindor, Tories are Slytherin and Charles III is Dambldor.

 No.18092 KONTRA

>>18091
Clearly you lack theory. Tories are Ravenclaw, Slitherin is UKIP/Reform. Don't wax poetically about liberal western society if you don't even understand the canon.

 No.18093 KONTRA

Russia is Joanne Rowling, Ukraine is tranny and Donbas is a little girl in women's bathroom.

 No.18094

Wect is playing chess maybe real worry is Russia just shot another GOAAAL?

 No.18095 KONTRA

GOOOL.mp4 (529.65 KB, 720x534)


 No.18096 KONTRA

donald.jpg (10.26 KB, 138x200)

>>18095
This made me laugh more than it should have.

 No.18097 KONTRA

>>18095
I'm so tired of my coworkers overusing this meme >_<

 No.18103

noice (1).png (110.09 KB, 260x218)

1401629521002.png (193.11 KB, 471x356)

benisinurmom.jpg (137.01 KB, 457x752)

9e3.png (76.7 KB, 282x386)

>>18097
Teach them other memes.
Take those boomer memes that no one remembers anymore, so they look fresh again.

 No.18236

IMG_5622.webp (42.37 KB, 760x507)

I go to bed and when I wake up someone tried to cap Drumpf
and he accidentally made the most kino shot of the entire campaign lmao.
If I was a dem campaign strategist I’d just tie a noose lol.

 No.18237

>>18236
A German news outlet said that in a statement Trump said he can't believe such an action is possible in this country. Does he know anything about the history of the greatest country in the world?!

Interesting happenings, though.

 No.18238 KONTRA

>>18236
Place your bets:

1) Biden administration assassination job because now prez can do what he wants lol
2) "isolated case", see also: 1)
3) false flag because Donnie watched too much Machete

 No.18239 KONTRA

>>18238
>false flag

He wouldn't take a hit 5mm away from his head in that case.

I'm pretty sure it was actually just some permanently online reddit/twitter retard.

Pic related.

 No.18240

>>18239
This. It was obviously some le reddit leftshit. He missed, because soyboys can never shoot straight. Comes from reduced testosterone / elevated estrogene caused by eating soy and no meat.

 No.18241

>>18240
World Peace by World Soy (WS) is now a viable option for pacifists to end conflicts all over the world.

 No.18243

>>18239
Yes, but how did he manage to bring AR-15 to rally?
Even if backpacks are not scanned, you won't fit it there.

 No.18244

>>18241
They are trying this. What do you think all the vegan propaganda is all about? Make all men defenseless, that's the whole point of it.

 No.18245 KONTRA

>>18243
He wasn't at the rally, he was outside on a building afaik.

 No.18246

>>18243
He did not go into the rally area afaik

>>18244
>What do you think all the vegan propaganda is all about?

World Soy (WS) as I said. Imagine we cannot kill each other with assault rifles and small guns anymore. It would be a disgrace and the end of masculinity which personally, I admit, makes me scared like a little girl.

 No.18247 KONTRA

>>18246
> world soy
> can not kill each others
Niggers, muslims, chinks and kikes aren't fed soy, only white men have been turned into soyboys. It's part of white genocide. They can and will still kill us, and they are doing exactly that, while we stand by and do nothing about the umpteenth nigger gang rape.

 No.18248

tofu.jpg (74.42 KB, 1200x1500)

>>18247
Aren't these people malnutrioned idiots who never will reach white intellect? Use your brain, fag.

 No.18249

>>18247
>Niggers, muslims, chinks and kikes aren't fed soy, only white men have been turned into soyboys.

You know that soy as food isn't a western invention, right?

 No.18250

no path to 270, jack.png (277.6 KB, 735x405)

>>18236
Trump didn't miss a beat with that fist raise. The man too angry to die. After the next round of polls, Biden may finally see the writing on the wall. It's the Dems only chance.

 No.18251

Donald Trump is chancellor Palpatine and antifa are Jedi. Have you watched "Revenge of the Sith"?

 No.18252

maxresdefault.jpg (114.25 KB, 1280x720)

>>18250
There is 0 chances for the democrats now.
NATO is over, empire America is over, Urine is over, NWO is over, EU is over. Because obvious leftshit is too homosex to shoot straight.

 No.18253

>>18252
Imagine believing that the future free world depends on you, and then not training. smh. The secret service sniper demonstrated the enormous gap between an amateur and a pro.

 No.18254

>>18253
The SS clowns should probably buy some glasses



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